YSU - Eminent Domain

[rusty river]

this project started with deceit from the beginning. ysu hired a firm from cleveland that has ties with david sweet and hunter morris that used their own definition of blight that was against the definition that the us supreme court upheld in the meaning of blight and this company defintion was way out bounds for the recent Ohio supreme court decision on the definition of blight that is one of the many deceitful practices that ysu, ytown catholic diocese and the city used to start this robber baron war with a honorable businessman in ytown. the naysayers if they have the backbone should have a face to face discussion with all parties involved and i will be there to add more than my two cents in this matter on the behalf of joe grenga and his family's business. this is one of many of the memos i will write on this topic because i have been there from the start. let the games begin!

Some questions/comments...

What Cleveland firm do you reference?
His name is Hunter MorrisON.
What was the company's/David Sweet's/Hunter MorrisON's definition of blight?
What US supreme court case are you referencing?
What Ohio supreme court case are you referencing?
Please note that the Catholic Diocese of Youngstown has given up property for the university's project.

I also submit that considering David Sweet's and Hunter Morrison's reputations as being some of the country's leading experts in the field of urban development, they are more than qualified to offer a legitimate definition of blight.

[iwasthere]

this project started with deceit from the beginning. ysu hired a firm from cleveland that has ties with david sweet and hunter morris that used their own definition of blight that was against the definition that the us supreme court upheld in the meaning of blight and this company defintion was way out bounds for the recent Ohio supreme court decision on the definition of blight that is one of the many deceitful practices that ysu, ytown catholic diocese and the city used to start this robber baron war with a honorable businessman in ytown. the naysayers if they have the backbone should have a face to face discussion with all parties involved and i will be there to add more than my two cents in this matter on the behalf of joe grenga and his family's business. this is one of many of the memos i will write on this topic because i have been there from the start. let the games begin!

[ytowner]

This Grenga guy is whacked.... I'd love to see what was in the garage of his...

I hear NOTHING!

[Towntalk]

Here is what could have happened with the Grenda property if he had been reasonable.

Youngstown to buy land for expansion of V&M Star
http://www.vindy.com/news/2008/dec/19/youngstown-to-buy-land-for-expansion-of-vampm/

[AllanY2525]

Towntalk hit the nail right on the head.  The city did not have to offer this man
another building, or money, OR help in moving to another building because the
expansion of YSU is a project that will be of benefit to the general public,
not to mention the fact that it will be yet another improvement in the blighted
areas to the south of the university, and will result in the removal of an old
and delapidated building to make way for brand new buildings and infrastructure.

From what I've read in the past, the new project at YSU will use approximately
thirty eight ACRES of land between the current southern boundary of the campus
and the downtown area.

When was the last time that ANY project in Youngstown (other than residential
dwelling construction) built thirty eight acres of new, state-of-the art stuff that
the public sector can make use of?

The basic principle of using Eminant Domain for a project like the one involving
Y.S.U. is "The Public Good".  Just like building a new freeway, for example.

If the man who owns this building had ONE HUNDRED employees, the loss of his
business to a neighboring city would still PALE in comparison to an expansion at
Youngstown State University that will potentially bring a couple THOUSAND
students to Youngstown, as well as additional faculty.

Some of these will be students and faculty members that reside in Youngstown,
go to stores and other businesses in Youngstown, etc, etc ad-nauseum.  Many of
them, through their tuition at YSU and their discretionary spending, will be bringing
out-of-state monies INTO Youngstown, which is EXACTLY the kind of thing the
city needs - get the money from out-of-town to come INTO town !

Like Mr. Spock said in one of the Star Trek movies:

"Logic dictates...that the needs of the many...outweigh the needs of the few...
OR THE ONE".

[ytowner]

They don't have this type of problem in communist countries.

30 days buddy, 30 more days haha.

[Why?Town]

They don't have this type of problem in communist countries.

[Towntalk]

Whether he does business there or on the South Side is beside the point. The fact is that the City offered him a building on Andrews Avenue, an offer he refused is the point.

In point of fact, they offered him a great deal of money for the building, which he also refused.

I'm not crazy about eminent domain as a pratice, but when a city makes good faith efforts to help the property owner, and he constantly refuses, what other choice does the city have?

Remember when they were building the expressway and peoperty owners had their property seized by eminent domain and the got pennies on the dollar with no effort made to help them relocate?

At least the city offered Mr. Grenda a building to replace his building on Rayen Avenue.

As the 2010 project moves forward you'll see the city taking more property. Should the city just toss the 2010 Plan in the waste basket and forget the whole thing? I don't think so.

[Shar]

The building on Rayen Avenue in question is the old Hood Electric building.  Mr. Grenga uses the building for storage.  His business is on the south side.  I can see the building in question out the window of my office 8 hours a day, 5 days a week and there is no "business" there.  It is storage, nothing but storage.

[ytowner]

O well... Nothing new is happening under Jay. He inherited a budget surplus and will end his first term with a budget shortfall. Nothing new here in the Mahoning Valley.

When will we learn fiscal spending is the way to go. Maybe one day I can teach this Valley a thing or two about getting your finances in check!

And Jay.... Maybe Mr. Grenga should've took the BUSINESS FRIENDLY offer to move to Andrews Ave. Since he refused and was nothing more than an 'ass' the entire time, he get's what he pays for.

O WELL

[Towntalk]

Some Questions:

1. Again, how many people does Mr. Grenga employ?
2. How much taxes does Mr. Grenga pay?
3. How much has it cost the city to fight Mr, Grenga?

If he had a substantial number of employees that were paying wage taxes to the city, I could agree with you, but so far no one has answered that question.

As to the city being business friendly, I remind you that the city offered Mr. Grenga a building free and clear on Andrews Avenue, but he refused it.

People tout the 2010 Plan and rightfully so, but when it comes right down to the harsh realities of that plan, they start to back away from it.

This business with Mr. Gringa has gone on now for two or three years at the tax payers expense, and it's got to stop.

You're right that the city has financial problems, and all the more reason why it should just proceed with eminent domain and be done with it.

[jay]

According to the TV news this morning, the City of Youngstown is facing a $3.5 million shortfall for 2009.

I would think that the city should be as business friendly as it could be.

[ytowner]

Good. The guy was an idiot for holding up the process.

[Towntalk]

The city wanted to give "the man" a building on Andrews Avenue but he turned them down flat.

Just how many people does "this man" employ?

Given the headaches "he's" given the city, I say let "him" move out of the city.

By the way, "the gentleman" does have a name, it's Joseph Grenga and the name of his business is Grenga Machine and Welding Co..

If the city just went and took his building cold out of the blue that would be a horse of a different color, but that's not the case. They've made him several very good offers, and he's turned them all down.

They offered him a new building on Andrews Avenue,

They offered him money several times.

They even offered to help him move.

An industrial business belongs in an area designated indusrial, and not at the doorsteps of a University, and not in the heart of town.

There are plenty of locations that they could relocate him, one being Andrews Avenue and another the Riverbend Industrial Park.

[jay]

Heard On The Street

See the story in today's newspaper about the property on Rayen Avenue which was taken by eminent domain.

I've heard that a representative of a valley city is offering the gentleman a building plus a ten year tax abatement to move his business from Youngstown to their city.