The Youngstown School Levy

[jay]

Representatives of the school levy committee made a presentation to the West Side Citizens' Coalition on Tuesday evening.  One member of the audience asked how many Youngstown school teachers send their own children to the Youngstown city schools.  The levy committee did not have an answer.  The person asking the question said that he knew three Youngstown teachers with school age children and none of them were educating their children in the Youngstown system.

In general, most members of the audience were against the levy for various reasons.  Many just couldn't afford to pay the additional property tax.

[our2cents]

I think I once heard since the _early_ 90's.

That was what the paper we had said.  Considering how many districts totally mis-manage and ask for more every other year, YCS has done pretty good with what they had.  The district is still managing their money.  The big change was the huge shift of students to the new charter schools.  The paper also stated exact amounts of money per student lost by the district when they lost a student.

[northside lurker]

We debated a response to this since it started.  We agree totally with your post.  Thank you for putting it into words.

Same here, well said Allan.

Also, the district hasn't asked for an "operating levy" since the 90s I believe it was.

I think I once heard since the _early_ 90's.

[our2cents]

Anyways, that's my $0.02... for what it's worth.....

We debated a response to this since it started.  We agree totally with your post.  Thank you for putting it into words.

Also, the district hasn't asked for an "operating levy" since the 90s I believe it was.  I had a paper outlining it, but can't find it now.  The paper also outlined how the state funding comes into the district per child...and then the district has to write a check to the charter school for each child that goes there.

[AllanY2525]

The Youngstown City School District got a grant a while back for $126-(million) to rebuild their
schools, as a part of that plan, The Rayen School building was supposed to be closed for a
year or so, gutted and modernized inside and then re-opened as The Rayen Middle School.

The plan was changed, and now The Rayen School building will be demolished altogether,
and a brand-new middle school built in its place.  The Rayen School student body will
be combined with the East High School student population in the new East High School
building as a result.

The city IS downsizing the built infrastructure of it's school system to match the current
size of the population here in Y-Town.

As for new school levies, I can't really make an educated comment on this issue as I
do not have enough of the facts to do so... but I think the teachers in the Y.C.S.D. are
to be commended for sticking around when they could easily get better paying jobs
and better benefits elsewhere, in other communities.

School teachers (in general - not making any SPECIFIC references here, folks....)
are generally one of the most under-paid, and under-appreciated - segments of
the work force in this country - and they deserve our support.

Bear in mind that these kids will be running the country some day - they deserve
the best education we can possibly give them - which means hiring the best and
the brightest of teaching staff, etc that we can for our schools

As the owner of multiple properties in the city, I pay several times the amount of
property taxes that an ordinary Youngstown citizen would pay per year, and I personally
don't mind the idea of the tax levy - and I do NOT have any kids, so I do not receive
any services, etc from Youngstown's school system.  I consider my property taxes
a gift to the city/county and I DO NOT MIND paying these taxes, not one "iota". (sp??  :::grin::: )

I can TOTALLY understand the point of view expressed by those who are already bearing
a substantial tax burden and who do not want or need yet another hike in
their tax rates - but unfortunately,  this issue is a "double-edged  sword" which cuts BOTH
ways (sort of a catch-22 situation, if you will.....)  in that the city MUST improve their
school system unless they want to continue to lose students to other, better
equipped and better staffed school districts in the suburbs, or to private schools here
in the city.

One of the FIRST things people consider when thinking about moving into a
town or city (IF they have kids, that is...) is the quality of the schools in that
area.  If our schools su%#,  [explitive deleted] then working class people with school-aged
children are NOT going to want to move into Youngstown, let alone stay here
for any length of time.

If Youngstown can successfully rebuild the school system and get better
pay and benefits, then she can attract more working class families to
move here (or STAY here...) - which, in turn, brings (or KEEPS)  more TAX
REVENUES, which - again - will help to support the school system, the police
department, the fire department, the street department, etc, etc etc, ad-naseum...

I'm not taking sides here, because both sides of this problem have very, VERY valid
concerns. Hopefully, something will be worked out that everyone can live with...in the
end run, it's the kids' futures which are at stake here....and I personally wish them nothing
but the very best in education - they WILL need it when they grow up and go out into the
world as young adults.  Youngstown is still chock-full of bright, intelligent, talented
and motivated young people -  and we all must make the most of this precious, valuable human
resource.


Anyways, that's my $0.02... for what it's worth.....

Allan

[ForumManager]

No, I think the information you shared was good.  It helps voters to make informed decisions about voting for tax issues.

[northside lurker]

It was an entire school year!  LOL

We submitted construction drawings to the construction manager FIVE times, starting on April 15,2004.  We were already being delayed before that, because the construction manager was already telling us to cut stuff out.  Our final submission--the one the contractors used to calculate their bids--was submitted on February 2, 2005.  The foundation package went out for bids on August 7, 2003.

To be fair to the construction manager, the cost of materials was beginning to skyrocket during that time, so they had a difficult time making an accurate estimate.

We seem to have gotten off subject here.  I origiannly joined this topic because I didn't want the school board to take the blame for something that wasn't necessarily their fault.

[ForumManager]

Thanks for the details.
My information (rumor) came  from a former Chaney teacher, so unfortunately that is what is criculating around the schools.

The work appeared to have stopped part of the way through because the parking lots and foundations were part of separate contracts that were done earlier.

It was an entire school year!  LOL

[northside lurker]

Trumbull County took less money and built less schools (smaller too) because of declining enrollment. 

I can only speak for the Warren school district, but they did eliminate an elementary school because of declining enrollment.  The remaining schools actually got a bit larger to accommodate the slight increase in the number of students that would have gone to the eliminated school.

[northside lurker]

I guess that is what happens when it takes several years to implement a plan.
I still can't follow what the plan is.
Is it outlined somewhere online?step by step?

I don't know the details of the plan. (and because the OSFC is a bureaucracy, I'm sure there are a LOT of details)
You can check out the OSFC's website to see if they outline the process.
http://www.osfc.state.oh.us

As I understand the process, the OSFC assesses each school district to determine their need. (condition of existing structures, financial status, enrollment, etc.)  Next, they create a master plan based on the assessment.  Then, the district has to pass a levy for their portion of the cost to execute the master plan.  When the levy is passed, work can begin.  If the levy doesn't pass, the district has a limited number of second tries to get it passed.  If the levy continues to fail, that district loses the opportunity to use the state funds.  Some of the wealthier districts elect not to use the state funds, because they don't want to be tied down by what the state says they need. (and the state would only be providing a small percentage of the funds anyway)

I heard that Chaney took so long because the contractors didn't have enough minority employees and they were forced to stop work. 
Was that issue posted on this forum at some point as well?  Can't remember.

This was not the case at all.  The official reason is that we had a hard time getting the project under budget.  The real reason is that the massive inflation in the cost of building materials and the construction manager's inability to estimate the cost of the project caused us to submit, re-submit, and re-re-submit our final drawings.  For example, we cut $1 million out of the design and re-submitted our drawings.  Their new estimate INCREASED. (I said we should have put all the stuff back into the design so the price would go back down)  Eventually, the construction manager agreed that we should just go ahead and put the job out to bid (get bids from contractors) and the contractors' prices came in a lot closer to the budget.

The work appeared to have stopped part of the way through because the parking lots and foundations were part of separate contracts that were done earlier.  If we had been able to stay on schedule, there probably wouldn't have been a noticeable pause.

[Micky]

Trumbull County took less money and built less schools (smaller too) because of declining enrollment. 

[ForumManager]

I guess that is what happens when it takes several years to implement a plan.
I still can't follow what the plan is.
Is it outlined somewhere online?step by step?
I heard that Chaney took so long because the contractors didn't have enough minority employees and they were forced to stop work. 
Was that issue posted on this forum at some point as well?  Can't remember.

[northside lurker]

Many feel that the school board has constructed more new school buildings than it will need and thus the board has waisted existing tax money.

The Ohio School Facilities Commission (OSFC) evaluated the YCSD and determined the amount of space the city needed.  As part of the deal with the state, the YCSD has to build what the OSFC tells them.  Apparently, the student population dropped more than the OSFC expected.

[jay]

This is another concern that I've heard.  As neighborhoods continue to decline, more and more families are leaving the city.  The number of students in the public school system drops year after year.  Is there a bottom to this decline?  Many feel that the school board has constructed more new school buildings than it will need and thus the board has wasted existing tax money.

[Micky]

My neighbors are outraged by the School Board's request for this levy.  They're mostly elderly people who live on fixed small incomes.  They've said that the population of Youngstown is declining and the student population is also declining with a lot of students going to Charter Schools.  The news stations said that most of the levy money will go towards the wages and fringes of the employees. 

The School Board could and should make even further cuts. 

Absolutely NO to the levy.