Martini's

[Towntalk]

As I understand it, most of the restaurants along Federal Street are doing good, and more are looking to move into the area.

If all these eateries can make a hefty dollar, that tells me at least that there is traffic downtown with disposable cash ... you know, that green paper that Uncle Sam and the Federal Reserve print up ... and a wallet full of plastic ... the ingredients that any businessman hungers and thirsts for, so why wouldn't a retail store look at that and say to themselves ... 'How can I get some of that trade.'

Place a small shop between the eateries, give it a good appearance with smart window displays that don't look like Goodwill or some second hand store, but look like the shop windows at the Malls, and folks will stop in to see what's for sale and buy stuff.

The shops that are already down there almost without exception lack the kind of appeal that would draw in people with disposable cash.

The interior is also important. Goods displays attract buyers if they are attractive, but displays that look like a Salvation Army store or Joe's Rummage Sale just don't cut it. And the store must be spotlessly clean and brightly lit.

Customer service is also a key to success. If a sales clerk has a turn off attitude, that store will fall flat on its face. Just because a store is a small startup doesn't say that it doesn't have to compete with the Mall stores so far as customer service is concerned.

[AllanY2525]

Westsider,

You make some excellent - and interesting - points here.  Kind of like the movie "Field of
Dreams", where the theme is "If you build it, they will come".   With regard to middle-class
and middle-income housing downtown, I think you hit it right on the mark with what you said
in your last post on this topic.

The problem with the retail business is this: They won't come until there are already enough
people living downtown (who actually have the income to spend) to justify the risk and
expense of building many of these businesses downtown. 

They cannot afford to spend large amounts of their venture capital and then sit back and wait
for people to move downtown and start shopping in their establishment(s) - the consumer base
will have to be there BEFORE they build their stores downtown.

Getting the middle class and the working class to move into downtown housing is the first step.

[northside lurker]

As of now, how many residential units are actually ready for folks to move into?
(not including the seniors' apartments that are already downtown)

None, that I'm aware of.

I've read that there was a study done in Cleveland that said they expect that about 2% of the region's population would want to live in downtown Cleveland.  And, from what I've continued to read, the downtown Cleveland housing market is one of fastest growing in the country. (despite the slow housing market)

If enough infrastructure was created, (like groceries, and other services) I don't see why we couldn't expect that 2% of our population would want to live downtown.  The population of Mahoning county is somewhere around 250k, but I think the Youngstown Metropolitan Statistical Area has about 650k residents.  That's a lot of potential people downtown.

Finally, I also don't think the apartment types being planned by Mr Frangos are satisfying all possible market types.  What I mean by that is this.  Mr. Frangos will only be providing high end apartments, and apartments for college students.  What about people who want raw space, like that found in the Ward Bakery building, so they can build the unit out however they want? (or maybe they want to keep it raw?)  Or, what about mid range apartments for single guys like me who don't want to pay a high price for a 2-3 bedroom apartment?

[AllanY2525]

I think that any others who might be considering the development of residential
living space downtown are waiting and watching, to see if the owner(s) of the existing
residential developments can actually FILL those housing units, first.

As of now, how many residential units are actually ready for folks to move into?
(not including the seniors' apartments that are already downtown)

[ytowner]

What is the point of this post, Jay?

That is what I was hinting at lol!

[northside lurker]

Thanks for the update Phil!

I'm glad to hear that there is interest in achieving balance in what is available downtown.  Is there interest in additional residential? (besides what Mr. Frangos is doing?)  Or are the powers that be waiting to see how well the Realty building does?

[Towntalk]

Once again Phil you are absolutely right.

Phil said:

"Now, I think it's becoming evident that - should the Core, Lemon Grove, J.R. Davis, upstairs of Imbibe/Lemon Grove, indeed move forward with development - you are reaching a saturation level downtown regarding traditional bars/restaurants - until substantial residential is developed."

"From this point forward, I believe we need to start to shift future development a little more toward specific need (i.e. a late night diner; retail ex. Cell phone store; small grocery-pharmacy/card store; gas station; art gallery; catering; antique store). Balance will become important for continued growth, especially if we will soon have folks living in the downtown area with disposable incomes."

I never could understand why there was so much empthesis on "dining out" to the exclusion of other businesses downtown.

As the owner of Imbibe and the Rosetta Stone have pointed out, business is good and getting better, so now we need to turn our attention to other kinds of businesses that will draw folks downtown during the daytime hours, and I'm certain that you are the one who can work your magic on this next step.

Thanks for all your hard work.

[Defend Youngstown]

That is a list of recent closings. Here is a list for openings:

Capitol Grill
Santa Fe
Mocha Coffee House (opening soon)
Lemon Grove (opening soon)
9 bids in for the Core
multiple bids in for J.R. Davis site
2 spaces (above Imbibe and Lemon Grove) that are looking to be developed

The whole Martini thing is really getting way, WAY more play than it should. Matt Sutton is a great downtown business owner, a great general downtown patriot, and a personal friend. However, without him moving to ground level, everyone knew this day was coming (to include Matt). The reason he is relocating is because 1.) he is no longer one of only what was a short time ago a few downtown restaurants - there are many more options 2.) his business is in the basement of a building whose ground level doors close at 9pm. 3.) there is no exterior signage on ground level to indicate his business is inside 4.) he's been offered a sweetheart deal by a private investor in Canfield. He has indicated that, if successful in Canfield, he'd like to have a satellite location based in downtown someday. I hope he does. I will miss Matt and the way he conducts business.

Now, I think it's becoming evident that - should the Core, Lemon Grove, J.R. Davis, upstairs of Imbibe/Lemon Grove, indeed move forward with development - you are reaching a saturation level downtown regarding traditional bars/restaurants - until substantial residential is developed.

The exception: There is a good chance BW3's will not have their lease renewed next year so we will be in need of a sports bar downtown (if they can't work out a deal to remain downtown in regards to a few locations they are looking at).

From this point forward, I believe we need to start to shift future development a little more toward specific need (i.e. a late night diner; retail ex. Cell phone store; small grocery-pharmacy/card store; gas station; art gallery; catering; antique store). Balance will become important for continued growth, especially if we will soon have folks living in the downtown area with disposable incomes.

PK

[cc4]

R. I. P.

Location, Location, Location!!!

Economy, Economy, Economy!

[northside lurker]

What is the point of this post, Jay?

[ytowner]

Great post!

[jay]

Bean Counter
Old Precinct
Core
Wok Inn
Martini's