Republicans gain control of the U.S. House of Representatives.
Kasich winning in Ohio.
Tea Party candidates are winning, and the main street pundits are flabbergasted over it.
Throughout the campaign they were putting the Tea Party down and resorted to name calling and outright slanders, but now they have to eat crow and its sticking in their throats.
I'm not looking for any legislative victories from the new congress. What I am looking for is extreme gridlock. NO legislation from Congress is the best thing that can happen at this time.
How did Dennis do state-wide?
Who's Dennis?
Unofficial from Secretary of State as of 12:30 AM
Dennis Spisak - 54,767
For the next two years we here in the 17th Congressional District can expect to see the amount of pork we receive cut in half (if not more), and I predict that we will see our congressional district changed when it comes time for the redistricting process to occur.
As for state money coming in, look for that to be cut in half if not more ... "to the victor come the spoils ... and the valley was not in the victor column yesterday.
The President today at his press conference.
Election 2010 will mean we will give limited government a try......if it succeeds great....
if not, liberals and progressives will be back in vogue by 2012......
Quote from: Towntalk on November 03, 2010, 10:24:51 AM
For the next two years we here in the 17th Congressional District can expect to see the amount of pork we receive cut in half (if not more), and I predict that we will see our congressional district changed when it comes time for the redistricting process to occur.
As for state money coming in, look for that to be cut in half if not more ... "to the victor come the spoils ... and the valley was not in the victor column yesterday.
To a certain extent we can thank Dave Betras and Bruce Zoldan for that. Glad to see that they made such an issue of Humphries backing Kasich. Im sure the Valley is on the Gov's radar now. Nice. Good Job Boys!
Quote from: Towntalk on November 03, 2010, 10:24:51 AM
For the next two years we here in the 17th Congressional District can expect to see the amount of pork we receive cut in half (if not more), and I predict that we will see our congressional district changed when it comes time for the redistricting process to occur.
As for state money coming in, look for that to be cut in half if not more ... "to the victor come the spoils ... and the valley was not in the victor column yesterday.
Considering Kasich's platform, I don't see why the MV will be any different from any other part of the state in this. After all, he wants to give $400 million back to the federal gov't, killing the 3C passenger rail project.
In regards to the rail system, if free enterprise determines that it is not a good risk on return, the money should go back to the taxpayers government.
Quote from: Youngstownshrimp on November 04, 2010, 01:57:03 PM
In regards to the rail system, if free enterprise determines that it is not a good risk on return, the money should go back to the taxpayers government.
I can agree with that, when we privatize the interstate highway system as well.
We paid for those highways through our road and gasoline taxes, the government didn't give them to us. We have just decided through our vote for Kascich that we don't want to pay for passenger rail, that most of us won't use.
waiting for all the state's assests to go up for sale on E-Bay after Kasich is sworn in.....
Quote from: Dan Moadus on November 04, 2010, 04:46:06 PM
We paid for those highways through our road and gasoline taxes,
Yes, partly. http://mahoningvalley.info/forum/index.php?topic=7575.0
Quotethe government didn't give them to us. We have just decided through our vote for Kascich that we don't want to pay for passenger rail, that most of us won't use.
And one could argue that, as other states with high population densities--like Ohio--invest in passenger rail, Ohio will be left even further behind.
Construction of a roadway is one of the core functions of government. It is a public utility required by all citizens in order to survive and function. Can't say the same about passenger rail in that corridor. It is a luxury that we simply cannot afford right now.
Quote from: Rick Rowlands on November 04, 2010, 10:44:29 PM
Construction of a roadway is one of the core functions of government. It is a public utility required by all citizens in order to survive and function. Can't say the same about passenger rail in that corridor. It is a luxury that we simply cannot afford right now.
Construction of the interstate highway system was just as "unconstitutional" as universal health care. They created a loophole by adding "defense" to the title of the act that outlined its construction.
The highway system mostly built under Eisenhower was during a time when we were at our peak economically. Forget the rail system, we need to start making our own clothes again. As a boy in Asia when my father was fighting for free enterprise in Vietnam, there was a rice shortage so we all just started eating bread. "We can't afford rice folks."
Quote from: Youngstownshrimp on November 05, 2010, 07:23:48 AM
The highway system mostly built under Eisenhower was during a time when we were at our peak economically. Forget the rail system, we need to start making our own clothes again. As a boy in Asia when my father was fighting for free enterprise in Vietnam, there was a rice shortage so we all just started eating bread. "We can't afford rice [rail] folks."
Sure we can.
- First, the money is there. Since Ohio isn't spending the money, it will just go to other states to improve their passenger rail systems. I know, to the Republicans, it's about ideology at this point, but is that productive?
- Second, I've read that ODOT will be spending an additional $471 million in highway spending this year that they didn't spend last year, and they don't know where the money will come from yet. If times are so tough, maybe we shouldn't be expanding highway spending either?
How many Forum members attended the Ohio Department of Transportation's workshop in Youngstown last evening?
mahoningvalley.info/forum/index.php?topic=9228.0 (http://mahoningvalley.info/forum/index.php?topic=9228.0)
Start reading global business news, you are intentionally being confused to believe that we have money for this and for that. Global money does not work like that, what promises we are getting from all our governments is all subject to the creditors approval and funding.
Now honestly ask yourselves, why has not all of the stimulus money been spent? Because our creditors are pulling back from funding our entitled asses. We use their money to pay our interest and also ask for additional debt to pay the entitled party. Global money is not stupid, someone in China is looking at the Rail system and laughing, saying "and how are they going to pay us back for this ?"
If you really want the rail, as we say in business, bring CSX, Norfolk Southern, etc. to the table with some investment capital.
Quote from: jay on November 05, 2010, 08:33:42 AM
How many Forum members attended the Ohio Department of Transportation's workshop in Youngstown last evening?
mahoningvalley.info/forum/index.php?topic=9228.0 (http://mahoningvalley.info/forum/index.php?topic=9228.0)
It's something I would have been interested in, but I couldn't go.
Well the money may be in place to BUILD the rail system, but the state will have to pay to OPERATE it, and that money is not in place. Killing the 3C corridor was a wise move for now. Come on, if we can't agree on cutting this fringe project to save the whole state, then you just don't care if the state goes bankrupt.
OK enough of this partisan bickering. Here is something that will lighten your day. (ok well maybe for some of you it will be funny).
http://www.therightscoop.com/glenn-beck-happy-days-are-here-again
Glenn Beck is a poser and a loser.....
Quote from: Rick Rowlands on November 05, 2010, 12:09:37 PM
Well the money may be in place to BUILD the rail system, but the state will have to pay to OPERATE it, and that money is not in place. Killing the 3C corridor was a wise move for now. Come on, if we can't agree on cutting this fringe project to save the whole state, then you just don't care if the state goes bankrupt.
That's certainly a valid concern. But the most conservative estimate I've seen stated that it would cost about $20 million per year to operate.
This is what I find most frustrating. ODOT spends an extra $475 million for roads and highways, on top of the other billion dollars they spend above what they bring in from user fees, and no one seems to care. (one might even say that, as the gov't subsidy from non-user fees approaches $2 billion, these people feel "entitled" to subsidized roads and highways... ;)) But as soon as someone proposes spending an extra $20 million per year on an alternate form of transportation, there is suddenly a problem.
Roads and infrastructure is one of the few things that government does that benefits all citizens, and is one of the core reasons why government exists. I will never complain about government expenses in maintaining roads. There are some on the right who say the roads should be privatized, they are completely full of it. THe $475 million will be spread to the four corners of the state, but if you don't live in the 3C corridor you will get no benefit from high speed rail.
I am sure they claim it will cost $20 million a year to operate, but when has any government estimate come in at or under that cost? Its always higher. Heck if one of their trainsets gets into a grade crossing accident with a semi truck that could easily cost $10 to $20 million.
Quote from: Rick Rowlands on November 05, 2010, 05:06:58 PM
Roads and infrastructure is one of the few things that government does that benefits all citizens, and is one of the core reasons why government exists. I will never complain about government expenses in maintaining roads. There are some on the right who say the roads should be privatized, they are completely full of it. THe $475 million will be spread to the four corners of the state, but if you don't live in the 3C corridor you will get no benefit from high speed rail.
I am sure they claim it will cost $20 million a year to operate, but when has any government estimate come in at or under that cost? Its always higher. Heck if one of their trainsets gets into a grade crossing accident with a semi truck that could easily cost $10 to $20 million.
About 7 million people live in the 3C corridor. I don't know all of the details, but the Cleveland-Youngstown-Pittsburgh line would have been part of the next step. I'd guess that, after step 2 was completed, about 75-80% of all Ohioans would be connected.
The experts don't claim it will cost $20 million, the conservatives have rounded the number up from $17 million.
I guess I'm done arguing about this because you are holding these two forms of transportation infrastructure to two different standards, when they should (IMO) be held to the same standard.
Roads benefit EVERYONE. The trains are like the busses which for some reason you consider to be the same as roads.
BTW, just last night I saw a full sized WRTA bus in Austintown. Since it was dark out I could easily see the ONE single passenger that whose ride I was subsidizing..
No. They are not the same. Railroads are private corporations. They purchased their own right of way, built their own tracks and equipment, maintain same, and on top of it all pay taxes on that. And then government wants to impose its will upon the railroads, force them to provide space for passenger trains, but not paying the railroads what that track time is worth.
Even if this passenger rail network is accessible to 75% of Ohioans, it still requires an auto trip to the train station, then another auto trip from the train station to final destination. It doesn't work at all if you need to go to the corner store, or want to go from Youngstown to the Rogers Sale on Fridays. But that ODOT road money does pave the roads between Youngstown and Rogers. Most trips are not long commutes between large cities but are little trips within 25 miles of home.
This is a bigger issue than the utility of passenger rail. Its about the government being broke. But some people refuse to acknowledge any limitation in that department. I don't know where you think this money comes from. You may be surprised to learn that it is not infinite! The people who live outside the city limits have just sent a loud message that we are finished throwing our money at projects that are of marginal benefit. These marginal public works projects are being canceled all over the US. Chris Christie canceled the tunnel project, Kasich will cancel the 3C corridor. We won't continue to pay for stuff that does not benefit us while the basic services that we need, ROADS, infrastructure, police and fire protection, are woefully inadequate. The good times are over.
Oh BTW, I am a railfan, so I would love to see passenger trains running through Youngstown again. So I have nothing against trains per se.
Quote from: Rick Rowlands on November 05, 2010, 10:15:25 PM
Oh BTW, I am a railfan, so I would love to see passenger trains running through Youngstown again. So I have nothing against trains per se.
Hey Rick , I have a cure for being a railfan , Work for a railroad for 30 + years . You wont want to ever see another train again hahahaha
I worked for CSX as a conductor and engineer for four years. After I left the railroad in 2004 my interest in trains had practically disappeared. Only recently with the donation of "fleet" of three locomotives has my interest in railroading started to return. But I don't think I'll ever have the same passion for the rails that I once had. Working T&E service on a class 1 railroad is brutal.
Rick, I started with Conrail/CSX in 1976 in the track department so you know what I mean . after all those years doing grunt work my body is shot, been disabled since December of last year . Its nice to be home .
Quote from: Why?Town on November 05, 2010, 07:55:55 PM
Roads benefit EVERYONE. The trains are like the busses which for some reason you consider to be the same as roads.
BTW, just last night I saw a full sized WRTA bus in Austintown. Since it was dark out I could easily see the ONE single passenger that whose ride I was subsidizing..
Because it was dark, that tells me it was probably the last bus. Why would lots of people be going to Austintown, if they weren't headed home? If they weren't headed home, they would be stranded. Or, if the bus was headed east, that bus had already taken most of its passengers to their destination, and that single person was probably going home from WalMart, or some other place along the way.
BTW, I know there are plenty of people out on the interstate right now whose drive I'm subsidizing.
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This is only semi-related, but those in favor of limited government might find it interesting. "Why Sprawl is a Conservative Issue" http://www.walkablestreets.com/conservative.htm It seems to me that Government started subsidizing roads because they couldn't compete with other forms of transportation. But, they did their job too well, and now other forms of transportation can't compete with roads. That's why I say: either privatize the roads and level the playing field, or subsidize (proportionally) other forms of transportation, too.
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I'm sorry I've pulled this thread so far off-topic. I just see this rail issue as a mistake by Kasich, and a sign of where we might be headed. Otherwise, I don't have an opinion either way, and I'm curious to see what he can do.
How do you privatize a road? Please explain this concept. Are you talking all roads, or just interstate highways?
Quote from: Rick Rowlands on November 06, 2010, 11:45:18 AM
How do you privatize a road? Please explain this concept. Are you talking all roads, or just interstate highways?
I haven't given privatization much thought; it just seems like a solution to why privately run trains don't exist. So, I guess I'd propose turning all interstates into toll roads, since they seem to be the biggest drain on ODOT's budget.
One the eve of turning over interstate highways into toll roads, would there be an immediate and quantifiable reduction in taxes so that us taxpayers don't feel as though we've just been socked with another tax?
Absolutely! If we're privatizing roads, not only would your federal and state income tax decrease a little, but the fuel tax should go away and registration fees, etc. would also go down.
I don't know if there would be enough of a reduction in taxes to make people OK with paying tolls, (maybe there would, I really do not know) but that's how socialism works. The tax burden is spread around to everyone so that the cost is easier to swallow.
Sorry to beat a dead horse, but apparently, ODOT and Gov.-elect Kasich have no problem spending $1.6 billion for highway improvements in Columbus.
http://www.dispatchpolitics.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2010/11/13/copy/new-leadership-unlikely-to-halt-i-7071-project.html?adsec=politics&sid=101
Actually if you read the article you will see that this is a non issue.
Quote from: Rick Rowlands on November 15, 2010, 06:12:12 PM
Actually if you read the article you will see that this is a non issue.
Are you referring to this: "Others say the first phase of I-70/71 reconstruction might be too far along, anyway, for the incoming administration to change."? If so, then Kasich should save ODOT $1.34 billion, and cancel the rest of the project since there is still time.
If he were so inclined, he could keep the $400 million from the feds, and use that $1.34 billion he saved to run the 3C train for the next 67 years. :)
His decision to cancel or keep the rest of this highway project will tell us whether his decision to cancel the 3C rail project was simply political or not. I will certainly have more respect for him if he also cancels the rest of this highway project; it will show that he is true to the principles he was elected on.
One big difference. Public roads are an essential and proper government service, while rail certainly is not. Let's take up the road that runs in front of your house and see how long you survive if you cannot get to the store, or to work, or anywhere for that matter.
But the man isn't even in office yet! So all of this is premature and the article is misleading in its tone. The article has already convicted Kasich of not acting when its too early for him to act.
I don't have as much of a problem with surface streets and local roads funded by local government. Theoretically, my property taxes are paying for the road in front of my house. Anyway, if the road in front of my house was gone, I'd get to the grocery store just like I always do--walk.
Sure he's not in office yet. But that hasn't stopped him from proclaiming the 3C is dead, and I believe it's almost as far along as the road work described in the article. (I'm honestly not sure of the exact timeline, but I believe construction of the 3C upgrades could have started within a year)