News:

FORUM HAS BEEN UPGRADED  - if you have trouble logging in, please tap/click "home"  and try again. Hopefully this upgrade addresses recent server issues.  Thank you for your patience. Forum Manager

MESSAGE ABOUT WEBSITE REGISTRATIONS
http://mahoningvalley.info/forum/index.php?topic=8677

Main Menu

Improve Mass Transit

Started by irishbobcat, May 21, 2008, 07:26:30 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Towntalk


Towntalk

I really hate to say it, but you will never see a WRTA bus travel down Federal Street again unless for some reason Commece Street is closed. Restaurant alone can not convince WRTA to reroute their buses onto Federal Street

Like you Jay, I can remember back when all the buses convirged on Federal Street, looped around Central Square, and South Avenue, and the electric buses, but like the steel mills those days are gone and like the mills, will never return unless gas prices get so high that people come to their senses and start using buses.

Just how high must gas prices get per gallon before this happens? $5.00 - $10.00?




jay

I remember when the Youngstown buses traveled down Federal Street and picked up passengers along the way.  I don't believe a single WRTA bus travels on East or West Federal Street anymore.

irishbobcat

Here's an interesting article how Downtown Youngstown Merchents helped pull the plug on rail transit in the 1950's.....

Merchants' Favoritism Toward Auto, Disdain for Transit is Self-Defeating

Commentary by Edson L. Tennyson, P.E.


Merchants often do work hard and risk money. But they can be extremely short-sighted when it comes to transportation, automobiles, and mass transit. Some examples from my own experience may help illustrate this.

Investors in Milwaukee's former electric rail transit system – where I was in operations management – did try to make a profit. But merchants were fascinated by the relatively small proportion of their clientele who accessed their stores by automobile.

The electric rail system served a Gimbel's department store just beyond the system's terminal. Gimbel's had no problem allowing their few customers in a few automobiles to back up in the street, blocking and slowing our rail cars, which were bringing in many customers.

That was back when most shoppers came by transit. No more. Facing dirty pool by various Wisconsin politicians and the Wisconsin Electric Power Company, the electric rail system was unable to make a profit and yet had no public subsidy (such as is lavished on automobiles). Milwaukee lost one of the best rapid transit services in the entire United States.

Passengers protested, but the politicians were not interested in the passengers Three city councilmen told the transit company that it was unfair to allow three wards in the city to have so much better transit service than the rest of the city got. That is the devious political mind at work.

Youngstown, Ohio provides another example. The transit system there struggled, trying to make a profit. But it was an uphill, hopeless effort – and investors had been disinvesting in the system by the time I became involved in operations

From 1951 to 1956 the Youngstown system made a nearly six percent return on the transit investment. But, again, favoritism was bestowed on the automobile. The transit system had trouble getting its buses through downtown because of illegally double-parked autos and autos backed up in the bus stops.

The transit company asked for a No Parking rule in the curb lane in peak periods to keep the buses moving. The merchants objected, even though most of their customers came by bus. Indeed, surveys found that most of the curb parking spaces were used, not by customers, but by merchants or their employees. (There were meters, but they would illegally "feed" them.)

We eventually persuaded the city council to open up the bus lanes, but after three months the merchants demanded parking be restored. Their motto was, and I quote, "Bus riders have to come to our stores, but motorists can go anywhere. We have to entice them." Yes, true. Motorists did go anywhere ... anywhere but downtown! And, by blocking buses, the merchants stopped many shoppers from using the bus service.

Today there are hardly any merchants left in downtown Youngstown. There are other reasons that make it particularly bad, but transit everywhere suffers similarly unless major segments are on reserved or private-right-of-way.


Urban rail transit was once the sixth largest industry inNorth America. It got no subsidy. It paid taxes. It even subsidized auto movement. Merchants would not support the very transit that populated their stores. instead, they supported the automobile subsidies that helped put transit out of business. So now we have transit subsidies.

Certainly, some political transit managements abuse subsidies, but one should not disparage honest, industrious transit managers who need subsidy in today's environment. indeed, they need a lot less subsidy than the automobile is getting.

It's true that merchants face very tough competition. But it is not nearly as tough as competing with a subsidized competitor with a convenient product. Highways do not have the capacity to adequately serve a major city – but they do have the capability to congest it to death. Many merchants would be prudent to revise their attitude toward mass transit and the major benefits it can provide.



Dennis Spisak

jay

A task force has been established to address Ohio's 21st Century Transportation Priorities.  Please check this website.
www.dot.state.oh.us/21ctptf

A regional meeting will be held in Akron on Monday, June 23.  I hope some leaders from the Mahoning Valley find the time to attend.

jay

I read a news story claiming real estate prices are dropping in suburban communities which are far away from employment centers.

Maybe in the future people will choose to live along mass transportation routes.

irishbobcat

#1
Improving Mass Transit in Mahoning County

May 22, 2008

As far back as 2001, the Sierra Club did a study on An Analysis of Mass Transit Spending in Ohio.

Their conclusions were:

Light rail and heavy rail tend to be more cost effective to operate than buses. The investment in a light or heavy rail system is not only economically efficient in the long term; it also has fewer impacts on the environment than highways. Two rail tracks have the same holding capacity as 16 lanes of highway. Rail also uses 35% to 40% less energy than cars.

The data also shows that systems with higher ridership rates tend to be more cost effective. As more individuals ride mass transit the service begins to recover capital and operating costs. However, the same is not true for most highways. As more and more cars fill up lanes on Interstate 71 in COlumbus it causes a demand for more capacity. Unlike mass transit, those drivers are not directly paying for a portion of that transportation service.

Many other urban transit systems throughout the nation receive higher percentages of their funds from their state government than Ohio urban transit systems. The state of Ohio only provides 5% and 10% of the total operating and capital funds respectively. Several other cities including Pittsburgh, Detroit, Baltimore, and Madison receive significantly more money from their respective states than those cities in Ohio.

Finally, analysis of the data affirms that there is a direct correlation between high-density neighborhoods and high ridership. Neighborhoods with seven units per acre or more enable a transit authority to provide a viable mass transit system. A dense neighborhood fosters high ridership. Typical suburban neighborhoods that have five units per acre or less will not have a successful mass transit system because there will be less riders. In these types of low density, single-use neighborhoods, residents are completely dependent on their automobiles to commute to all locations, near or far.

Their recommendations were:

The state of Ohio should increase funding for mass transit in its urban areas. Ohio residents are deprived of a multitude of transportation options. ODOT continues to build new highways and add more lanes, causing Ohioans to rely almost solely on their automobile.

Increasing state funding for operating and capital costs of mass transit would provide a better opportunity for multi-modalism including light rail, heavy rail, and enhanced bus services.

Cities also need to build neighborhoods that are denser and transit-oriented, to increase ridership. Neighborhoods that are seven units per acre or more enable higher ridership on a mass transit system. Transit-oriented development (TOD) refers to moderate to high-density development along a regional transit system. Most TOD programs are focused around rail transit stations, though the concept can be applied to a bus corridor. Ideally, TOD consists of housing and complementary retail, office, and public service development. TOD can reduce mobile source emissions by increasing transit mode share. Dense neighborhoods, like German Village in Columbus, have some of the highest-priced homes in the region yet continue to offer housing choice for people at varying income levels.

Finally, more cities in Ohio need to explore the merits of building light rail and heavy rail systems. Again, transit authorities in Columbus and Cincinnati are currently studying the feasibility of light rail service in their respective communities. Support for both light and heavy rail service in Ohio cities is necessary from public officials and area residents to make these travel modes a reality.

As the independent Green Party Candidate for State Representative for the 60th district, I have to ask my Democratic and Republican leaders in Columbus if this report has been around since 2001, why has no action been taken on it?

Why is no action being taken on it now as gas hits $3.85 a gallon?  Do big oil lobbyists have their hands even in the pockets of our state house and senate leaders in Columbus?

Could not a light rail system benefit the Mahoning Valley WRTA? Could we not run a rail system from all 4 directions of the county to Youngstown State University to reduce traffic and pollution on campus?

If Bob Hagan is the Progressive Liberal that he claims to be, why hasn't he pushed this issue while in Columbus since 2001?

It's time we send an Independent Green Party Candidate to Columbus to begin to transform our mass transit system from buses to light rail.

Dennis Spisak-Independent Green Party Candidate for State Representative-60th district

Campaign site: Http://votespisak.tripod.com